May 26, 2011 22:05
13 yrs ago
2 viewers *
Russian term

химико-механический завод

Russian to English Other Manufacturing
Что за зверь?

I have this several times in history documents.


С 1942 года началась подготовка техников-механиков химических заводов.

1 января 1946 г. образован Ленинградский механический завод "Новая деревня."

Discussion

Andrei B May 28, 2011:
Alex, this is how one may read your reasons: When Russian organizations use calques of their original names as English "self-descriptions" because of lack of command of English by their management, we'd rather expose their illiteracy than correct them
One should be better off with "chemical equipment plant" even though Russian plants of the kind in question specialize in equipment used in process engineering (valves, reactors) rather than in chemical labs (lasers, flasks)

Reasons aside, you simply misread the context
It's about history documents, not business entities: just химических заводов (without proper names), no matter what they might call themselves in English
But might they in 1942? Are you serious?
So, your reasoning misses the whole point of it

For the meaning of техников-механиков, look at the web pages of some Russian vocational colleges whose names are cognate with the term in question:
Омский химико-механический (ХМ) колледж
http://oxmk.ru/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=9&I...
Краснозаводский ХМ колледж
http://web.tsinet.ru:1080/~khmk/works.htm
Екатеринбургский ХМ техникум
http://www.exmt.narod.ru/Spec.htm
Владимирский ХМ колледж
http://www.vxmk33.ru/publ/spec/specialnosti/18
Alex Lane May 28, 2011:
Some additional comment... I favor the use of "chemical-mechanical" (with an en dash, not a hyphen) for the following reasons:<p>Quite a number of such Russian plants describe themselves in this way, in English, with said English formulation specified in official documents. (That said, I am aware that some number describe themselves as "chemical and mechanical" plants, too.) Whatever a business may call itself (short of something completely pathological), I am of the opinion that whatever it calls itself is what it should be called, and thus, whatever such plants typically call themselves is an acceptable (and I would go so far as to say preferable) translation.<P>If "process equipment plant" tickles your fancy, then in this context it must, in my opinion, have "chemical" tacked onto the beginning, because a plant that manufactures machines to process, say, breakfast cereal is equally a "process equipment plant." (In fact, I think you'd be better off with "chemical equipment plant" if you want to avoid the chemical/mechanical naming.)
Andrei B May 27, 2011:
Deborah: Please specify... whether your question is about
химико-механический завод
or
химический завод (as in context)

These are different kinds of plants, whose products have little in common:
Chemical plants' products are chemicals ranging from basic to "fine" ones, which are consumed in industrial processes (acids, plastics, etc) and as end products (cosmetics, pharmaceuticals), respectively; see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical_plant
whereas any "ХМЗ" in Russia (including ЭХМЗ) makes equipment and/or materials used in industrial chemical processes (reactors, filters, and the like); e.g., see
http://chemicalindustry.ru/276607.html
Collectively, plants of the latter kind are known as 'process engineering industry'

Note:
'mechanical plant' (in English) is not an industrial facility, see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_plant
Deborah Hoffman (asker) May 26, 2011:
контекст Далеко за пределами области известны технологическое оборудование для металлургии, выпускаемое Электростальским заводом тяжелого машиностроения и продукция химико-механического завода.

И еще:

Европий был похищен с территории химико-механического завода. Как сообщили в четверг в пресс-службе МВД Киргизии, несколько вооруженных людей в черных масках ворвались в ночь на 8 января на склад готовой продукции предприятия, расположенного в селе Орловка Чуйской области Киргизии, предварительно избив и разоружив его охрану.
Deborah Hoffman (asker) May 26, 2011:
Сорри Сейчас...
Roman Bardachev May 26, 2011:
Что-то я не вижу в контексте "химико-механический". Есть отдельно химический, и отдельно механический.

Proposed translations

+1
14 hrs
Selected

process equipment plant

The closest "English English" equivalent of
"химико-механический завод"

See a discussion entry and the references below

If the actual expression to be translated is "химический завод" (as in the context), then it would be simply
"chemical plant"


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 час (2011-05-27 13:52:13 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

To be sure, you can add 'chemical' => 'chemical process equipment plant'
'chemical equipment plant' is technically fine, too

However, neither of these is standard in "English English"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 дн (2011-06-02 07:03:43 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

Any time :-)
The research was easy to do: just sit back and google "химико-механический" + a couple of carefully chosen words matching the context (I call such words 'pinpointers')

Here's an extra advice
The context of "техников-механиков химических заводов" does not seem to be associated with particular plants. If this is true, you can simply translate this word combination as
"process equipment technicians"
e.g. see
http://boise.olx.com/wet-process-equipment-technician-iid-12...
Note from asker:
Thank you for your research into these exotic animals :-)
Peer comment(s):

agree IrinaDt : About "English English": As far as I noticed, a similiar company outside Russia works for more than just one industry (which also makes commercial sense). Maybe that's why there is no similar definition in English.
6 hrs
Thank you! But notice what makes sense inside Russia, too: http://www.energyland.info/companies-show-31569 http://www.ehmz.ru/price
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
+4
23 mins

chemical and mechanical plant

-
Peer comment(s):

agree rns : Elektrostal Chemical and Mechanical Plant as they put it — http://goo.gl/Tv1YC
5 hrs
Thank you, rns
agree Maruti Shinde : with 'and' it's more correct in English
6 hrs
Thank you, Maruti
agree Nataliia Gorina
7 hrs
Thank you, Nataliia
agree Denis Shepelev
8 hrs
Thank you, Denis
disagree Andrei B : A plant that is chemical AND mechanical at the same time would sound nonsensical in English - see discussion
14 hrs
Thank you, Andrei
neutral IrinaDt : Я бы не стала ссылаться на перевод самого ЭХМЗ... очень даже часто встречаются неточные переводы названий предприятий, так как велик соблазн перевести буквально, особенно когда слова интернациональные.
19 hrs
I am not making any references. Thank you, Irina
agree cyhul
4 days
Something went wrong...
23 mins

chemical-mechanical plant

Russian is famous for all sorts of technical hyphenations that defy neat compartmentalization. This is one of them. Plants engaged in this activity might, for example, make pressure vessels for the chemical industry, or gas masks.
Peer comment(s):

agree The Misha : There's definitely no such animal in "English English". Any way you put it is going to be awkward enough.
4 hrs
disagree Andrei B : "English English" is abundant enough to give sensible names to even more "exotic" animals
14 hrs
Something went wrong...
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