A special forum for CAT preference discussions? Thread poster: Antonín Otáhal
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Hi all,
I come to ProZ forums mainly to learn about technical points of various CAT tools, but lately there has been any number of threads discussing personal preferences/dislike/hate/love with respect to certain CAT tools.
I understand that sometimes an emotional contribution to a forum helps to get frustration off one's system; on the other hand prehaps such emotional things could be somewhere else than forums which are aimed at technical aspects (or rather, this is... See more Hi all,
I come to ProZ forums mainly to learn about technical points of various CAT tools, but lately there has been any number of threads discussing personal preferences/dislike/hate/love with respect to certain CAT tools.
I understand that sometimes an emotional contribution to a forum helps to get frustration off one's system; on the other hand prehaps such emotional things could be somewhere else than forums which are aimed at technical aspects (or rather, this is what I expect - maybe my expectations are wrong at this point?).
So, it is a suggestion to ProZ staff (to consider if a forum of this sort be worthwhile) and a question if others here have feelings similar to mine.
Antonin ▲ Collapse
| | | | | What about the general forum for CAT tools? | Sep 10, 2010 |
Hello Antonín,
There is a general forum for CAT tools, http://www.proz.com/forum/1 where preferences and comparisons of the various CAT tools can be discussed (as opposed to the specific forums for each CAT tool, which are more geared toward getting and giving help). Would this work for your needs?
Jared
| | | | Samuel Murray 
Netherlands
Local time: 09:45
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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| Two hot topics | Sep 10, 2010 |
Antonín Otáhal wrote:
...but lately there has been any number of threads discussing personal preferences/dislike/hate/love with respect to certain CAT tools.
The two hot topics on ProZ.com's forums are which CAT tool is better and why clients dare to offer such low rates. I have previously suggested that a separate forum be created for the latter topic (called, perhaps, "Whine about Money"), but that idea didn't fly with a lot of people. I don't think a forum dedicated to whining about CAT tools would fly either.
I do notice, however, that many users here are quite rude in CAT tool discussions and take very opportunity to turn any CAT related question into either a mudsling contest or an opportunity to make advertising for their own favourite product. This reduces the value of the CAT forums. It is a pity that moderators of those forums are not empowered to take a more active hand in weeding out such fluff.
| | | | Antonín Otáhal
Local time: 09:45
Member (2005)
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
@Jared
If people who do not have specific technical issues used the forum you speak about, it would be nice. Alas, they don’t. That is all.
@Samuel
I agree with you.
Antonin
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CAT-fight!!!
There used to be a forum area or something like that called CAT-fight - a long time ago.
Perhaps it should be resurrected?
Katalin
[Edited at 2010-09-10 23:15 GMT]
| | | | | Software proselitism | Sep 11, 2010 |
There is a now ancient and ingrained habit of software proselitism by users. If you buy some 'different' program and manage to lure enough people into buying it, its developer will blossom businesswise, and you'll have plenty of updates, upgrades, improvements, and solid user support for the years to come. If you don't make it, that software and its developer will wither and die.
I'll admit to guilty as charged in the past for Astound Presentation, whose last version 8, dated 2001, ... See more There is a now ancient and ingrained habit of software proselitism by users. If you buy some 'different' program and manage to lure enough people into buying it, its developer will blossom businesswise, and you'll have plenty of updates, upgrades, improvements, and solid user support for the years to come. If you don't make it, that software and its developer will wither and die.
I'll admit to guilty as charged in the past for Astound Presentation, whose last version 8, dated 2001, is still much, much better on all counts than PowerPoint 2007. However it was developed for Win 98, and had unresolvable bugs for which heavy users had to develop workarounds. Amazingly, after upgrading the OS to Win XP, all these flaws in Astound vanished at once! But it was too late... Astound had already buried their flagship product, changed name and the scope of their business.
I'll admit to guilty right now for InFix Pro, the new PDF editor devised for translation. I possibly influenced its developer to invest into developing features that would enable easier, CAT-tool-enabled PDF translation, and I am investing time and effort to master it and give them feedback to improve it. So the more users they get, better will be the chances that they'll make it, and I'll be using the market standard.
Off-topic here: Btw, I tried doing the same job twice, using the same TM: a) translating a PDF directly with WordFast Pro; and b) using InFix to translate it with WordFast Classic. Option (b) won hands down. IMHO the problem is mostly in the PDF structure itself, which InFix handles well, not WFpro's fault.
So what would stop Trados, WordFast, MemoQ, DejaVu, and other CAT tools users from doing the same? They invested money, as well as time and effort to master their choice. Now it's up to them to 'nurture' their investment, so it won't die. Hopefully, that choice of theirs will be the market standard, or at least the market leader, that's what they are rooting for in their proselitism.
This is okay among translators, the actual users; fair play. What amazes me is when translation agencies who - in most cases - don't use CAT tools themselves, demand the use of a specific 'brand' of CAT tool. It's like a passenger hailing a taxicab, and demanding that the vehicle must have automatic transmission and power steering, while they won't be driving themselves. Air conditioning for a long trip on a hot day would be a justifiable requirement, though.
So one possibility would be a forum for software proselitism. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jaroslaw Michalak
Poland
Local time: 09:45
Member (2004)
English to Polish
SITE LOCALIZER | A matter of style | Sep 11, 2010 |
José Henrique Lamensdorf wrote:
So what would stop Trados, WordFast, MemoQ, DejaVu, and other CAT tools users from doing the same? They invested money, as well as time and effort to master their choice. Now it's up to them to 'nurture' their investment, so it won't die. Hopefully, that choice of theirs will be the market standard, or at least the market leader, that's what they are rooting for in their proselitism.
It is not so much if they do it, but how they do it.
Any argument loses its force when repeated over and over. Emotional arguments grow old even faster...
Nowadays, when I see the seemingly always innocent question: "Which CAT to use?" (which makes about as much sense as "What car to drive?" It should be answered only: "Educate yourself on use of CATs, define your needs clearly, state your specialties, yearly workload and client preferences, and then come for advice"), I can already imagine the same people exchanging the same old punches...
I: Which CAT to use? I like the buttons of Y, but I've read X has nicer-sounding menu names...
A: Don't get X! It throws an error 3422345283 every two weeks!
B: X is fine! It works here.
C: X is crap. It did not import .dcv file in 2004, when I needed it.
A: Get Y instead.
B: But Y does not convert .thk, which are essential for my clients' well-being.
A: It does, you only have to print it out, cut out some sections with scissors and scan it back. Then just three converions and you're done.
B: X does it in one operation.
C: But then it crashes.
B: But not always.
D: Get Z. It runs fine on Linux, you need just two days to configure it.
A, B & C: Oh, shut up!
I: (Does not respond... probably due to irrecoverable brain damage inflicted by the above discussion.)
Don't get me wrong, I am not above a bit of CAT bashing myself, but lately it is getting somewhat out of control. That is why I am for the specific "CAT comparison" forum, if only so that moderators can direct there posts which do not answer the topic starter's questions directly.
| | | | Antonín Otáhal
Local time: 09:45
Member (2005)
English to Czech
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Jabberwock wrote:
That is why I am for the specific "CAT comparison" forum, if only so that moderators can direct there posts which do not answer the topic starter's questions directly.
I couldn't put it better. IMHO, it would be nice to have it and move there threads which get out of control and build another instance of "my CAT is better than yours" kindergarten stuff.
Antonin
[Edited at 2010-09-11 17:16 GMT]
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Drew MacFadyen
United States
Local time: 03:45
Spanish to English
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| CAT Tool comparison (CAT Fight) resurrection | Apr 12, 2012 |
I know this thread is a bit old, but I wanted to reply none the less.
I am currently working on resurrecting the CAT Fight area. Hopefully it will be relaunching some time in 2012 with the goal of launching during the annual September 30th freelance translation virtual conference.
The plans are to have the ability to quickly and easily compare translation tools (not just TM - but also MT, project management, workflow management and more) across a set of common parame... See more I know this thread is a bit old, but I wanted to reply none the less.
I am currently working on resurrecting the CAT Fight area. Hopefully it will be relaunching some time in 2012 with the goal of launching during the annual September 30th freelance translation virtual conference.
The plans are to have the ability to quickly and easily compare translation tools (not just TM - but also MT, project management, workflow management and more) across a set of common parameters - like operating system requirements, verified user reviews (this means that only those with an active installation/license can review), file filters and more.
Not sure if this software comparison tool will completely eliminate the type of forum posts described in this thread, but it should be a good start. Once launched, moderators of support forums can begin to direct posters with general comments/questions to the comparison tool.
There are also plans to include a section for "rants and raves" or "common problems/FAQ's" and also a "features wish list". The goal being a flexible, easy to navigate tool for comparing/learning about translation software, while also reducing the volume of duplicate forum posts and repeated posting of common questions.
If anyone would like to provide input, suggestions, or to be a beta tester prior to launch, simply contact me at [email protected]
Regards,
Drew ▲ Collapse
| | | | | What about a forum... | Apr 13, 2012 |
On no CAT at all??! The more I see so much waste of time and energy on technical discussions on file conversions and so on... the more I am convinced on the inefficiency of the tools...
| | | | Drew MacFadyen
United States
Local time: 03:45
Spanish to English
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| Seeking beta testers for a translator software comparison and feedback feature at ProZ.com | Sep 21, 2012 |
A feature containing detailed information and feedback on different translator software tools, with the option of comparing between different tools, is being developed (somewhat similar to the old "CAT Fight" feature, for those who remember it).
Beta testers with some level of experience in various translator software are currently being sought to test, provide feedback, and help improve this tool before its general release. If you are interested in doing so and in writing a review... See more A feature containing detailed information and feedback on different translator software tools, with the option of comparing between different tools, is being developed (somewhat similar to the old "CAT Fight" feature, for those who remember it).
Beta testers with some level of experience in various translator software are currently being sought to test, provide feedback, and help improve this tool before its general release. If you are interested in doing so and in writing a review for translator software you use, please contact site staff via the online support system to volunteer: http://www.proz.com/support/
Thank you
Drew ▲ Collapse
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